Anyone who reads my blog (and lets be honest – who doesn’t?) knows that I am a diehard SpectraLOCK junkie. For those who don’t know what that is, SpectraLOCK is an epoxy grout made by Laticrete. It is stain-proof, pet-proof, and bullet-proof! (Don’t try that, it’ll really piss off the wife…) If you don’t know any of that – you need to read my blog more! 
So just like everything I love – it changed.
Laticrete has recently come out with SpectraLOCK Pro Premium grout. A little birdie told me that this will replace the SpectraLOCK pro grout in the near future. Given that, I need to figure out how to use it – because it works differently than the stuff I’m used to. The difference in the workability may very well be due to the temperature, humidity, hangover flu bug, or any number of factors on the particular days I was working with it.
But it just doesn’t feel ‘normal’ to me – you know? It seems like it tightens up (gets stiff) and starts to roll out of the grout joints more quickly than the other stuff did. So, as with any installation product, if it begins to cure faster than you can use it you should just mix up smaller batches. And being the awesome DIY crowd you are – it’s probably a good idea for you to know how to do that anyway. So this is the best way I’ve found to do it.
A few basics first: SpectraLOCK is sold in different unit sizes. The base unit is called … wait for it … a FULL unit! Wait, where you goin’? This isn’t complicated like the metric system or anything, stick around. There is also the COMMERCIAL unit, which is what I buy (and you likely will not need) and it contains four full units. There is also the MINI unit – this is 1/4 of a full unit.
So: 1 commercial unit = 4 full units and 1 full unit = 4 mini units. Now, you can split up whatever you feel comfortable with, I split the full units into mini units. And this is what I’m about to show you. However, if you feel the need to split them into smaller units, or split the mini units into smaller units you can do that as well, you’ll just need to change the measurements.
When you break down the components into smaller units you need to do it by weight. I don’t see why splitting the liquids down by volume would be significantly different – but I was always told to break them down by weight. So do that. Really.
SpectraLOCK has three components, the part A and part B liquids and the part C powder. The part A is the yellow stuff in the foil bag, part B is the white stuff. Part C powder is in the carton. For this I’ll be splitting up one full unit so the bags and carton may look larger than what you have – mine’s bigger! 
You want to have a scale (scrape off the *ahem* ‘illegal substances’) and some one-quart ziploc baggies (the unused ones). For a full unit you’ll want to split each liquid into four baggies. Each liquid baggie weighs a different amount! So don’t just go puttin’ the same amount of everything in all the bags, it won’t work, you’ll have 1/2lb. of the white liquid left – then whaddya gonna do?
- Part A (foil bag) has 5 ounces of liquid in each baggie (4 baggies)
- Part B (white liquid) has 5.2 ounces in each baggie (4 baggies)
- Part C (powder) has 2.25 pounds in each baggie – or whatever you choose to dump it into (4 of ’em)
Just measure out all those components and zip them up. Once you’re done with that you’re ready to mix smaller batches in workable sizes. I just measure out the powder as I go along – I’m a rebel like that. 
AGAIN! If you have smaller units or want smaller batches you’ll have smaller measurements. You just need to weigh out what you have and split them into equal parts.
The photo above shows one full unit in the back, the two large bags and the carton, and one of the smaller units after I’ve measured them out, the two small baggies and the cup of powder. The amounts in the baggies and the cup is what you’ll be working with at one time.
To mix them just get yourself a nice clean container (scrub the beer coffee rings out of it) and add the two liquids together. Just roll up the baggie from the zipper side down until you have no room left to roll (like toothpaste) and snip off the corner of it with scissors. You can then squeeze all the liquid out of it with a minimum of mess.
Once you get those in there YOU NEED TO MIX THE LIQUID TOGETHER! Do that before adding the powder, or it’s gonna be one big mess you don’t wanna deal with – take my word on that. 
Once you get your liquids mixed together you can add the powder. Add about 75% of the powder first and mix it all up. Get a nice, smooth consistency, then you can add the rest of the powder. This helps get everything mixed evenly whereas if you dump it all in there and mix it you’ll spend more time getting an even mixture.
(Jesus, did I just type ‘whereas’??? I need a beer nap…)
Here's your grout - get to it! Quickly, damnit!
And that’s it. It’s all ready to go. When you grout, fill your grout lines and begin washing the tile in about 10-15 minutes. In another 40 minutes or so you can begin the second wash. I’ve noticed with the new stuff that you’ll only have about 35-45 minutes of what I consider ‘workable’ time. It’s not like it turns into a rock after 40 minutes, but it does become considerably more difficult to work with.
If you keep your batches small enough to install in that time frame it won’t be a problem – it’s when you go past the viable working time that it starts becoming difficult.
While I have voiced my displeasure with the new mix in a place or two, after I calmed down and sobered up thought about it I realized that SpectraLOCK is still the easiest epoxy grout on the market to work with. That, coupled with the rock solid (pun intended) color match you get from it, SpectraLOCK will still be my epoxy grout of choice.
I just need to quit being such a hard-headed bastard and learn to work with it a bit differently. One of the key factors in doing that is to keep the mixes in manageable batches. Just take your time, a little extra now will go a long way toward the long-term durability of your tile installation. And it WILL be stain-proof!
Here’s some basic information about the new stuff from Laticrete: Laticrete SpectraLOCK Pro Premium
And here’s a chart for coverage to see exactly how much you’ll need: Laticrete Grout Coverage Calculator
As always if you have any questions at all feel free to post them below. I’ll answer them once I sober up get home from work.
Hello! Love the site, it’s been helpful for our recent bathroom project.
I’m wondering: we’re on to grout, and I bought and used some of the regular SpectraLock grout. I used all of the parts per instructions, but it seemed like it was quite difficult to use with out 1/16″ grout lines on our subway tile. In particular, it seemed to harden up after about a half hour, so I couldn’t even use the full container.
I guess I’m wondering if 1) the Pro/Pro Premium stuff is easier to handle and lasts longer and 2) if you have any tips for spreading the stuff into such small joints.
Thanks!
Hey Ronny,
Yes, the pro-premium is easier to work with. It does last about the same amount of time. You can leave about 10 percent of the powder out of the mix and it will be easier to work with and get into the joints.
Roger:
This is my first time redoing a shower so forgive the novice question. I plan on using a stud-moisture barrier-0.42 Hardiebacker waterproof system (traditional). The 4-6 mil pvc goes up with staples. The staples are then covered with silicone. But what happens when I put up Hrdiebacker with Hardiebacker screws every 8″ and nail through the plastic to the studs? How do I cover this since the entire backerboard absorbs water and water can travel within the backerboard no matter if I cover the surface location of screws with silicone? Water can enter the Hardiebacker at any place and travel horizontally to the screws and then the studs.
Hi Rich,
Water does not travel horizontally. You are overthinking it – really.
The staples don’t need silicone either. The plastic ‘puckers’ around both the staples and the screws. When the backer comes into contact with it this creates a dam which water runs around rather than into as it runs down the wall. If it makes you feel better you can place a dab of silicone on the backer and insert your fastener through it. The silicone will seal the hole as you screw it in. Not needed – but if it helps you sleep better do it. 
Thank you..feel better and can sleep at night….
Hi Roger,
I have been steadfastly (ok more or less) following your various directions to tile out my bathroom floor (travertine), shower(ceramic), and non-shower walls (also travertine).
I have 2 questions – first for the grout, I have grouted before using standard grouts with no real issues and am now looking to try the laticrete grout based on your recommendations. I am going to start with the travertine floor and was thinking about sealing the travertine before I grout, hoping that this might protect the natural porous travertine from the permanent, never remove, impossible to clean off after the fact grout
Second for the non-shower walls (4×4 travertine) I was considering using Mastic instead of thinset (This project is my first with Thinset and I just seem to make a huge mess) since it is not a wet wall – Is this stupid? Should I just suck it up and push on with the thinset?
Thanks in advance!
Hi Jason,
Yes, seal the travertine first. It will make grouting much, much easier.
DO NOT use mastic with natural stone. The oils in the mastic can seep into the stone and discolor it.
Roger,
I’m planning to use the pro premium grout for my floor and shower surround. I’m also replacing my wood baseboard with 3×13 bullnose tile. What is the best order for doing that? Should I install the baseboard then grout everything together, or should I grout the floor first and put the baseboard on after? The thought of doing it all at once makes me wonder how hard it will be to keep the change of plane clean for caulking later. Any direction you can give me on this will be appreciated.
I also have some grout lines on the floor in particular that I scraped out perhaps a little too well (down to the floor) and I’m wondering if I should put some additional thinset in them, even if just to keep the grout coverage chart accurate (so I don’t use too much grout). I’m assuming that the norm is for grout to be the same depth (thickness) as the tile itself. Is that a good rule of thumb? I’ll be cleaning out some excess too (I figured out the grout saw even before your tile tip arrived in my inbox!), and my plan is to have it clean to about the depth of the tile, but wanted to get your take on that.
With regard to caulk, do you recommend the Laticrete (Latisil or sanded acrylic?) matching caulk for corners, or is there another brand that can be matched and do the job as well? How many tubes (ballpark) do you think it might take for a 3-wall tub surround (about 3′ x 5′ x 7′) and about 12 feet of baseboard? I’d like to purchase them online so some guidance will be helpful, and I promise I won’t take your name in vain if you’re off either way with your estimate. I’m sure you can make a more educated guess than I can, and I know there are variables you can’t account for (thickness of bead, waste, etc.).
Lastly, is it okay to just grout the outside corners of a niche, or is that considered a change of plane that needs caulk as well? I’m planning to caulk the inside corners.
Thanks again for all the great info you provide!
Hey Jay,
Install your tile and base then silicone it – then grout. That’s easiest. You do not need to add thinset between your tiles, you’ll create more problems. You need at least 2/3 the depth of the tile for the grout to bond properly. Grout is normally the depth of the tile, scraping the high ones down to only 2/3 will make up for the deeper ones. For a bathroom that size I would use 1/2 tub of latasil, so one full tube should be fine. (My changes of plane have 1/16″ spaces) You can get it here: Latasil Silicone. Acrylic-based caulks tend to dry out over time and lose elasticity, once they do that the bead will come loose and look like crap.
Yes, the outside corner of a niche is considered a change of plane. Yes, grout it.
I know, I don’t make the rules – some of them make no sense.
So should I silicone top and bottom of the baseboard tiles before grouting, or just the bottom?
Thanks.
Silicone both.
I got to thinking about my shower niche, which has bull nose overlapping straight tiles on all four sides, which I also mitered in the corners. Should I caulk that before grouting as well? Maybe that is different because the silicone needs to go last for the water tight seal. I’m still a little concerned about the transition of grout to caulk in the four inside corners at the outside edge. How is that supposed to work?
Thanks.
Hi Jay,
The outside change of plane normally gets grouted. If you are talking about the inside corners where you mitered them you can silicone before or after grouting. You’ll get a better seal after grout. Silicone will bond to the epoxy – the epoxy will not bond to cured silicone. If you do it after grouting you will have a very good bond.
How much sq ft does one mini cover? I’m looking at 25 sq ft on the floor.
Hi Jason,
It depends on the size of your tile. 25 feet of the 2×2 mosaics take 36 times more grout than 25 feet of 12×12.
You can download the coverage charts here: Spectralock coverage charts
Roger,
I’m getting close to the grout phase of the shower, and I’ll be using the Spectralock Pro for the entire enclosure. From the Laticrete coverage calculator, it appears that I’ll need about 12 mini units to do the whole job ceiling to floor. I though about getting one full unit for the floor (2″x2″x20SF), but using the mini units to do each section of the walls in stages.
One of the problems I’m having is matching the color of the existing grout to the Spectralock. The rest of the bathroom was done prior to me finding your website
, so I have already grouted the whirlpool tub surround, and the main floor.
I used Mapei Keracolor-S, Biscuit Color. I called Laticrete Tech Support, and they recommended using the Spectralock Pro, Marble Beige to match. I picked up color charts for both at Lowes last night, and I swear neither of the charts match what I installed, not even the Mapei chart.
Once the half wall cap, and glass panel are installed, there will be a physical separation of the grout joints/colors. The only joining area is at the end of the half wall where the glass door will be, but I can join the grouts at the corner on perpindicular planes to help mask any differences.
In your experience, would you have any color recommendations to match the Mapei Biscuit? Or a cheap way to test the match? I don’t want to have to buy 3-4 mini units just to do a test panel to determine which one matches. Although, I know it’s the best way to check it.
Thanks!
Hey Jim,
I saw your photos on fb. According to my super-secret cross reference charts the marble beige matches it. The laticrete is going to come out the same color as your grout chart. I would make the transition at the corners – you won’t see the difference if you do that.
It would be cheaper to buy full units and split them up as I’ve described above. Buying the mini units for the whole shower is going to be quite a bit more expensive.
Roger – Thanks!
I picked up one mini-unit in Marble Beige last night, and I took some Durock and spare tiles and made a test panel. Tonight I’m going to put the Mapei Biscuit grout in, and then tomorrow I’ll mix up a small bit of the Spectralock and see how well they match. It will also give me a chance to see how the Spectralock works and cleans up. Just a bit nervous since I’m an epoxy grout virgin
I’ve never done any type of grout on a ceiling before, but I can imagine the gravity is NOT your friend during this phase. Once the Spectralock grout is packed into the joints, how concerned do I need to be about sagging? Should I give it extra time to set before the initial cleaning, or let it set up in the bucket some before packing it in? I see the use of a Tyvek suit in my future
Hey Jim,
The new spectralock sags much less than the old stuff. The longer you let it set before installing it the less it will sag – but that’s not really an issue with the new stuff. Just don’t let it set too long.
Hi Roger,
If I use the Spectralock grout for my shower project, how long does it have to cure before we can use the shower? I checked their technical data sheet and it doesn’t specifically mention shower walls/floors.
Hey Dan,
You can use the shower after a 24 hour cure time.
Hey Roger, Do u see any problem with thinset holding up a .5 inch thick concrete tile? The heaviest tile will be hung as part of a shower wall and weighs about 100 pounds. I’m starting with 2×4 wood framing with half inch cement board and sealed with that pink stuff; I’m drawing a blank on the name.
Hey Brian,
The pink stuff is redgard. If it’s still pink it’s not cured – it should be red.
A 1/2″ thick tile of any substance is not a problem. No matter how big your tile is one square foot of a 12 x 12 tile weighs the same as one square foot of a 48 x 48 tile. It’s still the same weight per square foot (inch)l
Can tile be placed directly over drywall, for example above the backsplash?
Hi Bill,
It can be bonded to drywall in any non-wet area such as a backsplash, fireplace or waincots.
Roger,
Outstanding website and service to us serious DIY’s. I discovered it on a cross-country flight and managed to read almost every entry before we landed. The deep content mixed with your eclectic humor is refreshing and keeps it fun. Always good when the subject is tile! I also ordered and have already finished two of your e-books, which were great. But now, I’m really going for my money’s worth (as a paying customer) and have provided a lengthy overview of my current project with an accompanying set of questions. I’ll also be uploading pics as I go. You said you answer all you emails, I think you are a gonna pay for that commitment…:)
If what follows does not come through, or there’s a character limit on your blog inputs, or it’s just easier, please provide me with an email address and I’ll send this to you as an MS Word Doc.
Thanks in advance!!
——————————————————
Key info/data:
– Remodeling new master bath suite located on second floor
– 2′ x 12′ wood floor joists 16″ OC
– Demoing all walls and subfloor down to the studs and joists
– Bath is currently tiled with marble transition to master bedroom (carpeted) and has approximately a 1/2″ step-down height difference between current bath floor and master bedroom
– The shower wall edges, top of the half wall, face of the half wall, and the curb will be topped with granite from the vanity slab, but planned down to approx 7/8″ thick.
– After demo, a new subfloor will be put down using Advantech 23/32″ Tongue & Grove OSB which is exterior rated and significantly stronger than 3/4″ plywood
– New planned shower layout and size are as follows: It’s 5 sided and ~ 49″ (right wall) x 58″ (back wall) x 34″ (left half wall with 45 degree) x 21 ” (left half wall with 45 degree) x 34″ (curb). Drain is roughly centered and ~ 12-16″ from back wall.
Shower floor:
Planned shower floor construction approach from the sub-floor up is based on using the DIX One Liner system which also includes components from Mark E Industries (i.e., Pre Pitch, Quick Pitch, Redi-curb, and curb water proofing material). I choose the DIX system (www.dixsystems.com) because I’m hyper-concerned (versus hyper-paranoid) about doing everything possible to ensure there are no leaks from this shower as it’s on the second floor and directly over top of the high-end kitchen remodel I did a couple of years ago.
The following is my planned Shower Floor “sandwich” and construction order.
1. Heavy plastic/felt
2. Metal lath
3. Install bottom of Square Shower drain (Kohler)
4. Install bottom mortar bed (using Pre-pitch with extended sticks due to shower size)
5. Install DIX one piece One Liner
6. Waterproof curb using DIX provided materials
7. Accomplish “leak test”
8. Install Redi-Curb over rough-in curb
9. Install Top of Square shower drain, weep hole protector, and Quick-pitch (with extended sticks) for top mud layer
10. Install top mortar layer
11. install mortar on the curb
12. Tile floor and curb using mortar recommended for tile selected
13. Grout
14. Seal grout
15. Caulk or use Schluter DILEX-EKE when laying tile on floor (with a color as close to our planned grout color as possible) at all tile plane changes around the bottom of the shower floor where it meets the wall tile. See question 5 below.
16. Next step: move on to Shower walls
Questions/Guidance:
1) DIX instructions don’t call for plastic and wire lath underneath the bottom mortar layer, and the ADVANTEC sub-flooring is highly moisture resistant so it shouldn’t pull moisture out of the mud, BUT I assumed you would still recommend the plastic/wire lath…”True”?
2) Is the rest of my construction order and plan up to Floor-Elf standards?
3) As I analyze the Pre-pitch product (used to ensure the correct minimum pitch is produced for the initial mortar bed), it appears that using this as a screeting guide will create a constant pitch mortar bed, not a constant height at the walls mortar bed like you describe in your ebooks. In other words, given that my shower is not square the initial mortar bed will be comprised of circles of varying mud depths (all with same pitch). This is in contrast to the ovals your pictures depict which having varying mud thickness amounts, at the same distance from the drain, based on actual distance from the wall and your requirement for the shower mud bed height to be equal all the way around the shower where it meets the framing. If I understand this correctly, do you see any problem using the Pre-Pitch system for my initial mortar bed?
4) Do you have any recommendations or advice with regard to waterproofing the curb when using the DIX One Liner product? For example, should I consider waterproofing it with Kerdi membrane instead?
5) I plan the drain placement to be approximately as described above. Do you see any potential issues with that drain placement design?
6) Instead of caulking the change in plane tile-to-tile seams, I’m considering using the Schluter DILEX EKE product. Given your affinity for Schulter products, I was wondering if you’d ever installed this product? Regardless, I would appreciate hearing your thoughts and inputs on using it versus caulking.
7) As I noted above, I plan to set a ~7/8″ thick solid granite cap on the shower curb. Given that, I’m thinking about the following to make the curb the best height: Two 2x4s with a piece of 1/2″ Plywood sandwiched between them, then capped off with the granite. Thoughts?
Shower Walls:
Planned shower wall construction will start from framing that’s been checked and shimmed as required to ensure plumb and flat across the face for backerboard install. I’m debating a couple of options for the shower walls and would appreciate your assessment and feedback.
Option 1:
1. DuraRock attached to studs installed over the One Liner IAW DIX instructions (no. I won’t use drywall screws…:)~
2. Tape and mud seams
3. Waterproof walls with Kirdi membrane, Kirdi Band, Kirdi corner strips, Kirdi seal over shower pipe and unmodified thinset
4. Install initial tiles with unmodified thinset to layout grout line layout lines to cut niches
5. Cut Durarock and frame out niches
6. Waterproof niches with Kirdi membrane
7. Continue tiling with unmodified thinset
8. Tile niches and finish edges where vertical/horz tile plane edges with Schluter QUADEC
9. Grout
10. Seal grout
11. Caulk or use Schluter DILEX-EKE at wall and floor intersection (with a color as close to our planned grout color as possible)
Option 2:
1. Use Schluter 1/2″ KerdiBoard attached to studs installed over the One Liner IAW DIX instructions
2. Use Kerdiband and latex thin set (unmodified) to seal all Kerdiboard seams and screws
3. Repeat steps 4-11 from Option 1
Questions/Guidance:
1) Does the above order and plan pass Floor Elf muster?
2) Do you recommend Hardi Backerboard versus Durarock? If so, why?
3) Option 2 above seems way easier and potentially less likely to ever leak. When all is said and done, the costs are very close to even. Thoughts…recommendations?
4) If I don’t use the Schulter QUADEC to finish the shower niche edges, what would you recommend I do for the most professional and aesthetic look?
5) I’m installing 3 square Kohler body sprays which require cutting a plaster box/2 gang size hole in the backerboard. The sprays have a rubber gasket that presses against the tile for a supposed waterproof seal, but should I consider trying to jerry-rig some type of water proofing in the wall around the body spray boxes. Not sure it’s even doable, but thought I’d get your thoughts and ideas.
6) I will be tiling the shower all the way to the ceiling. We are thinking about a pointed tile detail row at the top. Any thoughts or inputs?
Bathroom Floor:
The bathroom floor will be tiled and have electric radiant heat. The entire bathroom will have new subfloor consisting of the 3/4″ ADVANTEC T&G OSB. The following is my planed construction materials and install order which is IAW the Schulter installation guidance.
1) Layer of modified Thinset
2) Lay custom Nu-Heat radiant floor heat mat
3) Cover radiant heat mat in layer of unmodified thinset and lay Ditra membrane
4) Lay tile on Ditra using unmodified thinset
5) Grout tile
6) Seal grout
7) Caulk outside edge (will be under baseboard trim)
Questions/Guidance:
1) Schulter doesn’t call for it, but I’m going to assume you may recommend a layer of 1/4” Hardi back board on top of the sub-floor before I start the above…true? If so, do you really think it is required in this install? I was also trying to avoid adding extra bathroom floor height that I’d have to transition when I go into the bedroom. Wanting to hopefully eliminate the requirement for a Hardi backer board layer is also another reason I went with the high-end ADVANTEC underlayment.
2) I debated on using Self-Leveling Floor Compound to cover the radiant floor mat before putting down the Ditra. But ultimately I estimated that between SLC prep (the edges, door damming etc) and the extra floor height SLC would create, to go with covering the mat in a layer of thinset instead. Thoughts or feedback?
3) Any tricks, gotchas and help on laying out and installing a diagonal tile pattern for the floor? We’ll be going for minimum grout lines.
Hi Jon,
1. Yes, use a cleavage membrane and wire lath anyway. Anything you can do to retain moisture in the mud as it cures will make it stronger. The lath also add strength to the bed (horizontally).
2. Yes, everything else sounds correct.
3. You can still use the pre-pitch – just shim up the ends of the sticks at the wall to create a consistent height.
4. The Dix waterproofing works well with their system – I’d stick with that. It’s actually easier than kerdi for anyone who hasn’t used kerdi – especially on a curb.
5. No problem with the drain placement – Just pay attention to the perimeter height.
6. I prefer the Dilex only for tile which it will enhance. In other words – it doesn’t look good with all types or colors of tile. If they have a finish that will go well with your tile it’s definitely worth it. It really looks good when finished.
7. The only problem you may run into with the curb height is local codes. In some areas there is a minimum height requirement for the curb to be 2″ over the finished tile height of the shower floor. I normally make them 2 1/2″ above the top mud bed and that compensates for tile height as well. Keep in mind this is the waterproofing on top of the curb which must be that height – not the top of the granite. That code may or may not apply in your area, just make sure to check first.
You can create a ‘speed bump’ of sorts beginning outside your shower entrance, take it up to your finished slope height needed, then run it back down to your drain. As long as you begin the slope up from the bathroom the same distance as your shower is deep (4′) you can have a curbless shower. It’ll actually have a curb, it’ll just be a speed bump instead.
WALLS:
1. Yes. The one thing I’ve noticed with both wall and floor (I’m sure you already know it, but the one time I don’t remind someone…) should you choose Dilex for your plane changes it must be installed at the same time tile is installed. With both the walls and floor you’ve listed it last. But you already knew that.
2. I prefer hardi – it isn’t chunky.
It is also not as porous as durock (yes, I still spell it incorrectly – on purpose now). Durock is messy and more difficult to work with, hardi is much easier to work with as well as being more kerdi-friendly.
3. Given the choice I would choose kerdi-board every time. I can install it in about 1/3 of the time I can do kerdi – and I’m frickin’ fast with kerdi! It is a very, very friendly product.
As far as being less likely to leak – all methods are the same. Built correctly they don’t leak, built incorrectly they do. Kerdi-board is easier to install correctly with less chance of screwing it up – even for me.
4. Bullnose is what I use in most of my showers. Since you are using the granite everywhere it may look good to have enough of that bullnosed to wrap the inside of the niche – that’s a good look as well.
5. Place a bead of silicone around the body spray openings as you install the tile, sandwiching it between the tile and kerdi. This creates a dam which water will run around as it runs down the wall behind the tile. The seals will prevent water from getting into the front from the face of the tile.
6. If you do the row on point at the top cut some and lay the row out on the floor to get an exact measurement, mark that line around the wall that distance from the LOWEST POINT on the ceiling (ceilings are NEVER level), then measure from that line to the shower floor to get the height of your bottom row. Don’t forget to add a grout line measurement between that line and the straight tile below it. This will give you a row on point at the top, then full tiles from there all the way to the one cut row at the bottom. It looks better if you have full tiles all the way up to your accent row.
BATHROOM FLOOR:
1. No need for the hardi on the bathroom floor. In my series about in-floor heat I had it there for specific structural reason (extraneous substrate movement in the house due to direct sunlight on that floor). Most installations can go right over plywood (or advantec) with the heating.
2. I prefer the thinset – SLC is a pain in the ass.
3. Use a chalk line to lay out your diagonal floor tile to ensure you don’t have any cuts you can’t wrap around a doorway or anything else funny like really small pieces, etc. Begin with 1/2 tile in the doorway so you have 1/2 tile, full tile, 1/2 tile in the doorway and move it side to side to get your layout so it looks good. Know where every tile is going to be before you cut or install any. I will also normally cut all the tile, lay it in there, then pull it up and install it. That saves you from any surprises.
I think I answered them all, and probably created 10 or 12 more.
YOU WIN!!! Longest. Question. Ever.
Roger,
Roger,
Thank you again both for being so incredibly responsive and for the excellent answers and insights. And you’re right, it did generate a few follow- on questions, which I’ll get o shortly.
When can I expect my plaque for longest entry/question set…:)?
Cheers,
Jon
i have done a few tile jobs but for some reason i listened to a guy at lowes that told me to use unsanded grout on my kitchen floor, i laid precelian tiles with a marble mosaic in the middle the grount lines are 3/16 ” the grout is flaking can you please tell me if it can be fixed or do i have to take all the grout out and replace with sanded grout if so after i stop crying over this what is the best way to remove the grout, i have heard everyting from a dremal to a skill saw on unsanded grout please help me thank you
Hey Betsy,
Unfortunately you will have to remove it and replace it with sanded or epoxy grout. Dremels or roto-zips work very well, but they do leave open the possibility for damaging the tile – especially the marble. I would use a regular grout saw you use by hand. It’s a lot of work but you’ll get a better result.
hi Roger thanks much for getting back to me, i figured that was going to be the answer but i wanted to make sure there wasnt another solution,,, your great to help folks like this have a great day
Can you say what the powder is for the SpectraLock epoxy grout ? Is it basically a fine sand mixture with color ? For a soapstone installation, could I use soapstone dust as part C of the 3-part epoxy mix ? Thanks.
Hi Simon,
I don’t know, and nobody is likely to let you know. Whole proprietary thing, you know. What you can do is call laticrete’s customer service and get the name and number of your local laticrete rep. These are the guys that answer questions for us pros, and they know their products! Most of them will give it to you straight as to whether you can or not. It may work – if it does PLEASE let me know. You might wanna let the rep know up front you aren’t worried about a warranty for this particular method – it usually gets you an answer more quickly.
Roger: I know you have mentioned this before but couldn’t find the info in earlier posts. Sorry you have to say the same crap over and over and over……..The vinegar cleaning solution for Spectralock is? And have you found the charts for estimation to be accurate? Is there a particular way to “join” a grout line in the event you run out of grout before the entire space is done?
Hey Russ,
No problem, I’ve have kids so I’m used to repeating myself – a lot.
The powdered cleaning solution is…proprietary. So I don’t know exactly what it is. I do know that when you run out of it you can use cascade dishwasher detergent (the powder in a box) and it’s essentially the same thing. It does not have, and you should not use, vinegar to clean tile or grout. Vinegar is an acid. Although a mild one, over time it still eats away at stuff.
I have found Laticrete charts to be extremely accurate. Always. I normally stop the grout at a 45 degree angle from the top of the tile back under the grout line. So your grout will go back under the grout line at a 45 degree angle and when you begin with the new stuff it will lock into it rather than having a straight 90 degree cold joint in the grout. With epoxy I don’t know that it’s necessary at all, but it doesn’t hurt.
A couple things- You are saying to not use vinigar now? Not sure I agree – Isn’t that what Laticrete officially recommends to use on the first and second rinse for Spectralock, or did that change with the new premium pro blend. Another thing, putting the mixed grout in a freezer can extend it for days. There is a lot of great info on the John Bridge tile forums about this stuff, whith a thread deducated to it for the last 7 years, including Laticrete reps giving tips on how to use it.
White vinegar is fine, most people do not make that distinction, however. It’s not needed. What is recommended is the cleaning packets included with the spectralock, in lieu of that the cascade as I’ve mentioned. I have not yet tried any type of white vinegar with the new spectralock – I do not recommend nor endorse products or methods I do not use or have not tried.
Laticrete SPECIFICALLY recommends that you DO NOT put spectralock in the freezer to extend working time. I’m well aware of the thread on john bridge’s forum. If you read through the entire thread you will likely find several posts from me. If you peruse the forum you’ll find over 2300 posts from me. I know about the laticrete reps’ advice, as well as Henry Rothberg’s recommendation against the freezer method – specifically. You can view that particular thread here: http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80492 and another here: http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=879607&postcount=835
Henry is not a ‘rep’, Henry is the Sr. Vice President of training. His brother is the CEO. His father created Laticrete. I listen to the guy.
That’s pretty much the final word for me.
Hi Roger. Thanks for the great website with lots of info. I am working on a tiled shower and I am considering using Spectralock, but I have a few questions/concerns. First, I am using sheets of flat river rock for the floor and up one wall. How would you suggest maintaining a void in the grout for caulking the change of plane when the tile does not have a straight edge? I was thinking I should fill the whole area with grout and then dig out a small channel after it starts to set up a bit. Does this sound like a good approach with spectralock?
Second, the shower is sealed with Hydroban, creating a waterproof membrane directly behind the tile/thinset (I am sure you know all about it). Will Spectralock bond to the hydroban? If it does, my concern is that if small amounts of water ever get behind the tile it will not be able work its way to the drain under the tile because of the impermeable spectralock. I know that there is usually thinset between the tiles that would come between the spectralock and the hydroban, but I completely cleaned out the joints, down to the hydroban, while installing the tile (OCD I guess).
Any advise would be greatly appreciated! -Devin
Hey Devin,
You can scrape out the grout to create the channel for silicone or you can install the silicone first, let it cure, then grout. Either works fine – the latter is easier.
The grout will not create a complete water-tight bond to the hydroban unless you actively pack it in there specifically for that purpose – and that would be difficult. Grout bonds to the sides of the tile – not the substrate.
Hi Roger,
I bought my Spectra lock tonight though it seems differant than the picture. It just says Spectra lock, Stain proof grout. It still requires parts abc. It appears not to be the Pro premium. Should I use this or do you suggest finding another retailer that carries pro premium.
Thanks much,
Steve
Hey Steve,
It’s just the older version (like before 45 days ago
) of spectralock. It will work just fine and works the same as I’ve described above. You’ll actually have a bit more working time with what you have there. If you want to get the pro premium it’s up to you, but there’s absolutely nothing wrong with what you have there.
As is the case with pretty much every two part epoxies out there, keeping the mixed batch in a fridge would extend its workable time. I haven’t worked with SpectraLOCK yet, though you’ve roused my interest. But I have experience with other epoxies where storing a mixed batch at about 32 degrees have increased workable time 10 times and more. I suspect the addition of the powder filler might skew the result but it should still be possible to “stretch” a 80-minute workable time epoxy into a full workday workable time epoxy by cooling the entire batch, then taking small amounts needed for a hour worth of work. Have you tried it with SpectraLOCK?
Cheers!
Hey Nick,
I have used the old spectralock in that manner and it worked well. Even when I was doing that, though, my laticrete guys’ heads would almost explode – they don’t want you doing that. Although it does work I was told that it compromises some of the strength of the cured product once installed. If the chemical process doesn’t take place in a certain amount of time it weakens the bond of molecules to other molecules and the grout is not as strong.
I have not tried that with the new stuff. No reason it wouldn’t work, it essentially just slows the chemical reaction, but I don’t know how it affects the final product. I will likely still place a small ball of the grout into the freezer for use after everything is cleaned up. There’s always that one damn spot that you missed. I just grab that frozen ball of grout and fix whatever I need to without having to mix up more grout.
Hi Roger,
Thank you for the info on using Spectra lock as well as your other answers.
I will be putting up a 4 1/2 inch backsplash from the countertop with a 1/2 round granite bar on top. Should I use thinset to install the 4 1/2 x 12 pieces to the wall or should I use a stone adhesive. I do have 1/4 inch Hardiebacker to the wall upto my 4 1/2 inch height.
Thanks much,
Steve
Hi Steve,
A good modified thinset will work for all that just fine.
Hmm. I missed the memo on the spectralock epoxy grout. I grouted my high-traffic kitchen with Polyblend sanded grout (#382 Bone color) followed by TileLab Surfaceguard Penetrating sealer x2 coats applied according to the instructions. I’m disappointed because it seems like it stains easily. Should I do anything differently at this point? Any advice on products to use to keep the grout clean? Should I seal the grout with a different product in addition to the TileLab SurfaceGuard penetrating sealer?
Thanks,
Mike
Hey Mike,
You can try a different sealer – it may help. I like Miracle Sealant’s 511 Impregnator. You can use it over what you have on there now. Oxygen bleach works really well to clean your grout. It’s in products like oxyclean.
Hey there!
So I went ahead and used the spectalock on my 1 x 1 marble floor installation. It was pretty easy to use. I completed it last night, did the two washes and there still seems to be a haze or residue. I then did the vinegar wash per the instructions and it still looks hazy. Do you have any tips? I’m not sure what to do at this point and I’m worried it will cure permanently on there! Thanks!
Hey There!
Get some powdered cascade dishwasher detergent and some white 3M scrub pads. A little elbow grease and it should come off fine. Alternatively you can use spectralock powder and create a paste with it (the powder and water) to scrub off any hard to remove areas.
thanx,
now to decide to return regular gorut for the epoxy …….
appreciate your advice……..
G’day
we considered this product but were intiminated by the work time & no one in the store really could tell us about the pros & cons of the stuff.
i would like to use this product but am concerned about the clean up. we have used a rough surfaced tile and am concerned about this stuff getting into the small cervices pinpoints, ET AL and drying before we can clean it off.
your advice with the red guard is much appreciated, the installation went well with tile now on the wall.
thanx,
hoke
Hey Hoke,
Within the first two hours the grout is actually fairly simple to clean off with a white scrub pad. It does come off easily enough.
After using the Laticrete’s SpectraLOCK grout, You still need to seal right?
Hi Anita,
Nope. The only thing that may need sealed is your tile. If it is natural stone like marble or travertine then yes, seal your installation. If you used glass, porcelain or ceramic then no – you don’t need to seal. It’s already done.
Re: weighing the liquid for mixing small batches of grout. To measure liquids accurately, you need to read the meniscus-the bottom curve of the liquid layer, in a calibrated vessel. This can be challenging at a dusty work site. So weighing is your best option. If you do want to measure liquids, get a good Nalgene graduated cylinder; sober up (BAC < .03) and read the meniscus. Household liquid measuring cups are not very accurate. I have been making small batches of joint compound, thin set and grout successfully with a kitchen scale and Pyrex measuring cup that I know runs 10% low. The calculations are a lot easier in the metric system. I'm not going to try epoxy grout until I am more proficient at tiling. BTW, I worked 40 years in labs before the call of home maintenance hit me.
Thanks Nancy,
Never thought about that point, but you’re correct. That may very well be the reason they want them weighed. You worked in a lab??? Wow, I couldn’t tell.
(I made it seven years before the politics almost made my head explode)
Sorry to be pedantic when you already knew measuring (and rarely at 20 degrees C and never at 1 atmosphere!) Lab Safety has an economy line of Nalgene cylinders if you ever want to go the liquid measure route. Sad that the politics caused you to leave the lab when there are some very vital labs in Fort Collins. For me it was the B-school bozos who didn’t know a spectrophotometer from a centrifuge cancelling my purchase orders. And the same bozos got better computers because they had to “crunch numbers.” Also interesting how similar tiling is to lab science: following instructions, attention to detail, cleaning the tools and work area, problem solving, working independently…. I’m glad you found your true calling.
Keep it up!
Nancy
I’m certainly no professional, having completed only four fairly small tiling projects, but I’ve used Laticrete’s SpectraLOCK for all of them. SpectraLOCK is terrific stuff. If I worked for that company. I’d be passionate about it too.
Agreed! It’s great stuff and a great company.
Awsome write up, you are the man. Sounds like they might need to change their claim of 80 min working time tho. I been more than happy with Laticretes other products and their tech support is pretty dang good too (or atleast the guy I got to speek with). Thanks again for the help. Couldn’t ask for a better website for tile info
I doubt they’ll change it. Technically it is still ‘workable’ at 80 minutes, but not nearly as much as the older version. It seems to me the old stuff stayed what I consider workable for just over an hour – this stuff just doesn’t. But you can grout with it up to 80 minutes, just not easily at all.
For the record Laticrete is a GREAT company and every tech rep, employee or representative I have ever been in contact with (and there have been a LOT) were always very professional, very knowledgeable and very passionate about what they do. If they didn’t know the answer they will damn sure find someone who does – and quick! If every company would do that the world would be a much better place.
You said in one of your other posts to me that you use Cascade packets in your wash mix are you talking about the ones with dawn in part of the packet?? If so I’m guessing you just slit the powder side and mix it up with around 2 gallons of water
Sorry, I meant the regular cascade in the box. I just add as much as they have of the powder in the spectralock packets.