There are three basic types of grout available for your tile installation. They are:

  • Non-Sanded (also known as Unsanded)
  • Sanded
  • Epoxy

Choosing the correct grout for your particular installation will not only complete the job correctly, it will also cut down on maintenance. Properly installed and sealed grout will last for the life of your tile. So which to use and when?

Non-Sanded (or Unsanded) Grout

Unsanded grout is made specifically for grout lines smaller than 1/8 inch wide.  This is a general rule. I use unsanded grout only in tile with grout lines smaller than 1/16″. Unsanded grout (all grout to different degrees) will shrink as it cures. The reason for only using it in smaller grout lines is the wider the grout lines, the more grout must be used to fill them. The more grout you have, the more it will shrink. If you try to fill grout lines that are too large the grout will shrink enough to pull away from the sides of the tile.

Unsanded grout is easier to work with, especially on vertical surfaces such as a shower wall, because  it is “stickier” than the sanded variety. You can spread it onto the wall and it will stick there while you force it into the grout lines. It is also much easier on the hands than sanded.  Although it is easier to work with, you need to make sure that the application for which you are using it is correct.

Sanded Grout

Sanded Grout is used for any size grout lines 1/8″ and wider. Although the specifications state unsanded grout be used in grout lines that are exactly 1/8″, you really should use sanded for them. It will ensure proper adhesion to your tile and guard against too much shrinkage. No, not Seinfeld shrinkage, grout shrinkage.

Sanded grout has fine sand added to it. This prevents the grout from shrinking too much as it cures. That’s why it is used for larger grout lines and should be used for the majority of tile installations.

If you have a polished stone such as granite, marble, limestone, and some polished travertine, you should be careful about using sanded grout. While sanded may be the correct choice for the size of grout lines, it may not be the best choice. Depending upon the polish of the stone the sand in the grout may actually scratch it. If you decide to use sanded make sure you test it in an inconspicuous area first to ensure it will not scratch your finish. Or use epoxy which would be a better choice anyway.

Epoxy Grout

Epoxy grout is the top of the line and best choice for any tile application. It can be substituted for sanded or unsanded grout.  It is more sturdy than both as well as being waterproof and stain resistant.

Epoxy is a two or three part chemical consisting of the base and the activator. With some brands the color is an additional part that must be added. Once the parts are mixed a chemical reaction begins. From that point, depending on the brand of epoxy, you have only a limited amount of time to get everything grouted before the grout becomes stiff enough to be unworkable. When it reaches that point, if you do not have everything grouted you are SOL.

To help slow the cure time you can mix your epoxy then put half of it in the freezer. The cold air will slow the chemical reaction and lengthen the working time. You can then work with the other half until it is all used. Clean it up, wipe everything down, then grab the second half out of the freezer and finish up. When you first pull it out of the freezer it will be, well, frozen. It thaws quickly, though, so should be workable within a few minutes. This essentially doubles the working time of your grout and ensures you don’t have to rush through it.

Since most epoxy grouts do not contain sand (or at least not in the classic sense of sand) it will normally not scratch your tile. If you have highly polished granite or marble that’s important. Be sure to test first anyway!

Different brands of epoxy have different working times as well as some being more difficult to work with than others. The brand with which I have had the most luck and the only brand I ever use is SpectraLOCK from Laticrete. It has a longer working time than any other epoxy grout (at least any I’ve ever used) and is virtually stain proof. Please don’t take that to mean the you can grout a jacuzzi with it, fill it with cherry kool-aid, and expect it not to be pink (Don’t do that). It just means that for all intents and purposes it will not stain without concerted effort. In my opinion it is the best on the market.

The only drawback of epoxy grout would be the price. It is fairly expensive. When weighed against the upside, however, it is well worth it. Low maintenance demands and high durability of epoxy grout make it well worth the money.

Picking the correct grout for your application is a key part of a proper tile installation. If you choose incorrectly you could end up with a multitude of problems and headaches. Grout, chosen and installed correctly, will complete your tile installation and push it from a good tile job to a great one. Do not underestimate the power of the grout.

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  • Joe

    Hi Roger,

    I’m getting ready to do a kitchen back splash and I have had many questions. I like to understand the tech behind a procedure and as a result most forums leave me with more questions. I’ve enjoyed reading your suggestions above and can see you really understand what you are doing. I’m more confident now to start on my project. :dance:

    thank you for your great site
    Joe

  • matt

    Hi. Thanks for all the info. I just finished putting the tiles up in my bathroom. And I went to lowes and hd to see what grout I should use. The gap between the tiles is about 1/8 maybe a little heavy in a couple places. I was told to use unsanded at lowes and sanded at hd. Now I have a row of glass tiles mixed in with my tile pattern. I heard sanded can scratch and my other tiles are a tan color not really a high gloss. What should I use??? Sanded, Unsanded or even the Epoxy. Thanks A lot

    • Roger

      Hi Matt,

      Sanded grout will not scratch most glass tiles. Really. :D

      You should use sanded grout for everything. Epoxy will work also. Unsanded is going to end up looking like hell.

      • matt

        Ok I saw at Lowes they have the pre-mixed stuff or the powder mix. What do you suggest? Also the they have grout booster that you add with the powder. What is your input?

        • Roger

          I wouldn’t use the pre-mixed, especially if you’re installing in a wet area. I would use the powdered with just water – no admix. Although it does seem to do what it says it will, it does make the grout difficult to work with.

          • Matt

            OK so powder grout. When curing the grout would you recommend spaying it down with water during the drying process???

            • Roger

              It never hurts to do that. The longer you can extend the curing time the stronger and more consistent your grout will be.

  • KRISTINA

    So I’m laying polished travertine in my entire bathroom. I just want to make sure i can use the spectralock in my shower floor? Sorry if this is a repeat question. And is the spectralock the best stuff to use outside of my shower on the polished travertine floors? :) thanks

    • KRISTINA

      Both grout lines are 1/8″ I just want to make sure i use the best stuff for both. And one more Q, sorry. So do I need to seal the tile before grout or after? Do I even have to seal it at all, the tile is like a marble/granite…? And from what I got from one of the other comments the best stuff to clean the haze is mild sulfamic acid or cascade dishwashing powder detergent? and should i clean it before it all dries?? Sorry, Thanks!

      • Roger

        Hi Kristina,

        Yes, you can use Spectralock on your tile – inside the shower as well as outside. In my opinion it is the best choice. If you use spectralock seal the tile before grouting – the grout does not need to be sealed. If it is a natural stone then yes, it should be sealed.

        DO NOT clean your travertine with sulfamic acid! Even mild sulfamic acid. It will etch the surface of your travertine. The best stuff to clean the haze off is utilizing the time frames of the grout, which are on the bucket, and using the cleaning packets included with the grout. Read the instructions and they will explain the installation requirements. If you run out of the cleaning packets before you are done you can use cascade dishwashing powder instead, using it in the same manner as the powders included with the grout.

        • KRISTINA

          WoW, Thank you for your fast response! Now I have another question….. I installed glass tile back splash in my kitchen and in parts the haze still has not come off, what is a good product to get this months old haze to come off with out scratching the glass??

          • KRISTINA

            So i went online looking for this spectralock grout and it looks like i can purchase this at my local lowes but i just want to make sure i am purchasing the correct stuff. So there is a 1ib bottle of liquid admix unsanded liquid grout and a 2ib tub of clear epoxy liquid grout, then there is sanded powder grout and epoxy powder grout. HELP! What do i buy?? Again, Thank you!

            • Roger

              You need the 2lb. bucket with the two liquids in it and one of the one-quart cartons of the epoxy powder. The other stuff is different types of grout.

          • Roger

            If it is epoxy grout you’ll need this: Epoxy grout haze remover If it is regular grout a microfiber towel and a 5:1 mix of white vinegar and water should take it off.

  • Andi

    We are going to be installing 12×12 mesh backed bamboo style marble tiles to our kitchen backsplash. The wall is painted drywall & the tiles seem heavy so I’m wondering if we need to use a certain kind of mastic or do a wall prep first & do what size trowel is best. I think we will need to go unsanded grout, I haven’t measured the grout lines but am pretty sure the tiles will scratch.

    • Roger

      Hey Andi,

      At the very least you should sand the ‘shine’ off of the wall so the adhesive can get a good bond. You do not want to use mastic for marble – you want to use thinset. Versabond from HD will work fine, or mapei ultraflex II from Lowes.

  • Ted

    I’ve used SpectraLock on my floors, was a big job and took me 3 nights to finish, can’t tell where I stopped or started.

    I do have a question, I am using travertine tile on my bathroom walls, I want to use the SpectraLock again, I will use 1/8 grout lines. Should I seal the tile first, I want the grout to fill the holes so it will be easier and more sanitary to clean. This area has a toilet and I want no problems in the future with little holes …well you get the picture….

    Great Site

    • Roger

      Hey Ted,

      I would install the travertine, then seal it, then grout with spectralock. It will still fill the holes and your installation will be sealed up tight.

  • Bill Karalis

    On your recommendation, I looked into the SpectraLOCK grout at Lowes but I also did some research on the internet
    I am looking for grout to use on a kitchen backsplash. I like the fact that the SpectraLOCK does not have to be sealed and is stain resistent. The backsplash I installed is made of horizontal strips of both glass and stone pieces. After reading more about the SpectraLOCK grout, it advises that it is a sanded grout and could scratch glass. Is there an epoxy grout that is not sand based that you would recommend for glass tile. Thank you

    • Roger

      Hi Bill,

      All epoxy grouts have some sort of aggregate in them which may scratch the glass. The sand in spectralock is very, very fine and I use it regularly on glass tile (inserts and such). You’ll want to double-check on a spare piece, but to be honest I have never seen it scratch a glass tile. I have installed tile which it would scratch, but I didn’t even try, I knew it would scratch.

      This depends on how your particular glass tile was manufactured. If you have a tile that has a ‘sticker’ on the back of it for the color to show through the front, spectralock isn’t going to scratch it. Look through the side of one of your pieces of glass – if it’s clear through the middle and your color is just on the back of the tile you’ll be fine.

  • Chris

    I’m installing natural stone wall tile backsplash from Lowes. The space between tiles is 1/8″. Should I use sanded grout for this? The guy at Lowes recommended unsanded grout.

    • Roger

      Hi Chris,

      Yes, use sanded. The guy at lowes has probably never mixed a batch of grout in his life, that’s what his sell sheet told him to say. :D

  • Peter

    Thanks for the great website! I have a question about an original 1928 tiled shower in our home. When we bought our house 2 years ago, water would leak from the shower down through the plaster ceiling below. We noticed the grout in the shower floor (small hexagonal tiles) was not intact, and hired someone to re-grout it. He was skeptical that this would fix it, but he filled in the gaps with a new layer of epoxy grout over the area to see if it would help. This seemed to stop the problem as we no longer have any water leaking through the plaster below when we use the shower. But after reading your site about how the grout and tiles themselves are not watertight, and leakage comes from a problem behind the tiles, I am wondering if we still have a problem here, and would appreciate your advice. I would love to avoid tearing the old shower out and replacing it, if there is any way to keep what’s there without causing bigger problems (which I am afraid may be happening now, though we no longer see water leaking).

    • Roger

      Hey Peter,

      Unfortunately if it was leaking then there is a leak below the tile in the shower pan somewhere. The epoxy will slow it, but water will still get behind there from the walls, which channel down into the drain. So wherever that leak is it is still leaking, although not as much. It probably is simply not saturating the framing enough to leak, but it’s still getting wet.

      Is there any way you can save the tile and have it reinstalled? If the grout was cracking it may have debonded the floor tile which would make it easier to take up.

      • Peter

        Thanks. I guess I should have specified that its not that I’m that attached to the original floor tile, as much as I’m attached to the idea of avoiding the cost and disruption of having to replace the original shower pan underneath and then re-tile. But I imagine a small leak over time is bad for the beams and ceiling below, even if we don’t notice a leak. Is it possible to replace the shower pan and floor tiles, only, without having tear out and replace the wall tiles as well?

        • Roger

          You’ll need to remove about two feet up from the floor on the wall so you can run the liner behind the wall.

          And if you go that far you may as well just build a new shower. :D

  • Bob Whitten

    If I use epoxy grout around the perimeter of the shower (where floor meets wall) would I still need to apply something like DOW 786 Silicone Caulk? (since you stated that “flexible sealant (such as silicone) is required at all changes of plane). The shower floor is tile with sanded-grout lines, as is the wall. Would there be a problem using epoxy around the perimeter, ie., using different types of grout on the floor?

    • Roger

      You need flexible sealant (silicone) at the changes of plane whether you use epoxy or not. If you use spectralock epoxy you can get silicone that matches it. You can have different grout on the floor and wall – no problem with that at all.

  • Gabe

    Hi Roger,
    Thank you so much again for the great website, excellent tips!!
    I am getting ready to grout and bought both sanded and unsanded grout (both Mapei Keracolor, almost white) with the intention of using sanded on the floor and unsanded on the walls.
    I have since realized that since all my joints are 1/16 th, the specification is to use only unsanded.
    Do you think this will be OK for the floor? I am specially concerned about the shower floor.
    Thank you again for the advice!

    • Roger

      Hi Gabe,

      It will be fine on the floor – cured unsanded grout is actually more dense than sanded grout. Sand is only there to keep it from shrinking in larger grout lines.

  • Bob Whitten

    Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. Very helpful information. You are very thorough in your answers. and I appreciate that. Talking to you is what I imagine it would be like talking to Tom Silva (TOH).

  • Bob Whitten

    Roger,
    I Googled “when should epoxy be used as a grout substitute” and was led to your site. What a great site it is. Your answers, along with the other recent history questions & answers were VERY HELPFUL. I have no brilliant retorts, but I do have one burning question: I’m repairing some shower grout lines; where the sanded-grout is firm and solid but has separated from the tile (usually on one side only), what is the correct way/product to seal this thin separation/crack?

    • Roger

      Hi Bob,

      You haven’t mentioned whether this is on a shower floor or wall – so I’m gonna assume a wall.

      It depends on why the grout separated from the tile. In most cases this is due to movement in the substrate caused by swelling. This is caused by the shower not being properly waterproofed. There is not a product (nor should there be) that you can apply to a cracked grout line to ‘seal’ the crack. There’s nothing to seal, grout isn’t waterproof. So…

      The proper procedure is to first figure out what is causing the problem. Is there movement in the wall? Is there swelling in the wall? Are these cracks ‘growing’ over time (that’s indicative of swelling). Once you have determined that, if it is not swelling and your installation is sound, the existing grout needs to be removed down to at least 2/3 the depth of the grout line. You can then simply regrout it and it should be fine.

      And the answer to your next question – the one rolling around in your head RIGHT NOW. :D

      Yes, epoxy grout is (essentially) waterproof – and no it will not fix the problem of water getting behind your tile. Your tile is not waterproof either. Epoxy will SLOW the absorption of water into the substrate, but it will not stop it. So it is not a long-term solution.

      And just in case you have a little extra question back there tugging at your brain: No, sealer does not waterproof your tile. It is a product used to assist cleaning and help the tile resist absorption of stains. It, again, will slow water, but definitely not stop it.

      Hope that helps (all your questions) :D

      • Bob Whitten

        Roger, thanks for your quick response. I didn’t like the answers but that’s not your fault.
        Yes, the separations are on the wall. But I read somewhere that sanded-grout won’t adhere to sanded-grout. So your suggestion to remove less than ALL the grout where the separation occurs is perplexing to me. So … will new sanded-grout adhere to old sanded-grout, or not?
        Also, the separations (to me, it’s not really a crack, per se :wink: ) ain’t growing and the wall doesn’t seem to be moving (no other visual clues in the bathroom) so I suspect improper substrate waterproofing may be the culprit, per your suggestion. Would bad moisture content of the grout when it was applied have caused the separation? I don’t want to rip out and retile the shower – the walls are 99% good. You didn’t mention silicone caulk. I read somewhere that silicone applied around the floor perimeter (where wall meets floor) is a MUST to do. Is this true? (My original ques didn’t mention the separation where wall meet floor but that is the main thing I want to address … I just thought that the silicone solution was the correct one. Do you agree??) So, following that logic, would a little clear silicone on the wall separations be kosher?

        Thx

      • Bob Whitten

        Also Roger, have you ever used something like DAP Clear Acrylic Latex Caulk Plus Silicone with a little dry sanded- grout powder added after applying the caulk to a crack?

        • Roger

          Unsanded grout won’t stick to unsanded grout either. Grout doesn’t stick to grout – grout adheres to the sides of the tile, my reason for removing 2/3 the depth of the tile – it will give the grout something to bond to. Moisture content (incorrect mixing, premature curing) of the grout could be the culprit if the grout was installed within the last three weeks or so. Longer than that and it won’t affect it unless it’s powdery and not solid.

          Flexible sealant (such as silicone) is required at all changes of plane (including where the wall meets the floor). The different planes, and especially the different substrate materials in the wall and floor, will have differential expansion – they will expand and contract at different rates than one-another. Flexible sealant can compensate for this movement, grout can not. If it’s cracking a lot there that’s why.

          You can put silicone in the cracks if that’s what you choose to do – I would not recommend it. Silicone is not a permanent product – acrylic-based caulk less so. It is intended to be replaced periodically because eventually the flexibility will lessen and the seal will be compromised. Once that happens it needs to be removed and replaced. It’s regular shower maintenance. Doing that in the separations may lead to problems.

          I have not added grout to any type of sealant. Laticrete, TEC, and custom, as well as many other grout manufacturers, make color-matched silicone to match most grout colors. And I don’t know if it would work in your cracks, I don’t caulk cracks. :D But it would look better than what you are proposing I think.

  • todd

    Thanks for good website. I know from reading your blog, you prefer Spectralock grout, but I also see some references to TEC Invision. For a travertine shower with a small leak in 10 year old grout, would you use Spetralock, TEC, or something else to replace the old grout?

    After cutting out the old cracking grout and installing the new grout, what would you use to seal on top of the travertine and the new grout? I really don’t want the leak to return and would like to seal the surface a few times if it helps any.

    • Roger

      Hey Todd,

      Let’s back up a sec – then I’ll answer your question, promise.

      When you type ‘small leak in 10 year-old grout’ – whaddya mean? Your shower is leaking? Because if that’s the case your grout has absolutely nothing to do with it. Your waterproofing is your shower substrate – beneath your tile. Grout absorbs water just like your driveway when it rains. So if your shower is leaking it’s a larger problem than grout.

      Now your answers:

      Invision grout from TEC is a urethane-based grout. Completely different animal from epoxy. Either will work fine and neither one ever need sealing. The urethane, however, is going to need a considerable amount of curing time before exposure to water – I’m talking about a week or more. Epoxy does not.

      If you have travertine (a stone, by the way, which also absorbs a considerable amount of moisture) you want to seal it before you grout. I use Miracle Sealant’s 511 impregnator pro. It’s a very good sealer. Sealer, however, does not waterproof anything – it is only made to slow the absorption of liquid so it does not soak into the stone and stain it. It will not stop it! It is still a product which allows moisture behind it. Vapor and water will get behind your sealer, no matter how many coats you place on it. (That isn’t entirely accurate, but to have enough coats you’d have a shower wall with an opaque layer of sealer on it).

  • Kevin

    Finished grouting my bathroom floor and my wife wants a darker color. She says it can be ‘colored’ darker (with some kind of marker?). Is this a realistic solution, or should I just out my grout saw and get to it…..

    • Jane

      That happened to us on my whole house tile. I painstakingly stained/sealed it at the same time. Get a good set of kneepads!

    • Roger

      Hey Kevin,

      Personally I would go out and get your grout saw. Then hand it to your wife. :D

      There are several grout colorants available, some in the form of a marker (although I can’t think of a specific brand in that format offhand). There are also two different types: a dye, which actually dyes the grout, and a topical, which is more like paint. To go from darker to lighter you need the topical. To go your way – lighter to darker – you can use either. I recommend the dye type, lasts longer.

  • Heather

    I am working on a bathroom countertop. It is done in a mosaic fashion using pieces of broken plates. There are, however large areas (about 6 inches or so) that do not have any pieces on them. Would an epoxy be best? Also can I pour a laquer over the finished grout?

    • Roger

      Hi Heather,

      Yes to both. Epoxy will be the only thing that will withstand that long-term. And you can pour ACRYLIC over it (not laquer) when it’s done.

  • Jim

    I am using ANTIQUE COPPER (Terra Sol Brand) tile in a kitchen back splash and the mfg reccomends a non sanded grout. Do you have any experience using SpectraLock Expoy Grout with a copper tile, 1/16 inch grout lines? Or should I stick with a regular non sanded grout. Thanks!

    • Roger

      Hey Jim,

      I haven’t used it on copper. You can call laticrete’s support line and ask them, or just go with unsanded. Laticrete’s reps are extremely knowledgeable and extremely helpful. If they don’t know the answer they’ll find someone who does.

  • Tyrel

    I just bought Laticrete Spectralock pro premium because Im going to use it on the walls, ceiling, and floor. I read that it has better non sag characteristics than just pro grout. I also read tho that it doesnt seem to have the 80 min working time like they claim. Just wondering what your opinion is on it, and if you use it, what you found to be the best application method for it. Should I switch to Pro for the next bathroom?? It has walls floor, and ceiling to do in the shower aswell. Any advice on using this would be great. Much thanks again

    • Roger

      Hey Tyrel,

      Yup, I’ve had about 30-40 minutes working time with the new stuff – I’m not happy about it. What I’ve done is take the full units and split them into four separate mini-units and work with one of them at a time, much more manageable. And clean it quickly – about ten minutes after grouting start your initial clean.

      EDIT: Just as an aside: Laticrete is phasing out the regular pro and moving to the pro-premium, so you won’t be able to get the old stuff soon.

      • Tyrel

        That’s what I wa figured. I saw a post of yours over on JBridges website. Would you reccomend using the premium or just pro on the next bath room too? I haven’t bought grout for it yet, or do you think stick with the premium since it will be on walls and ceiling for the supposedly better non sag capabilitys?

        • Roger

          You may as well go with the pro and get used to it. It does sag a hell of a lot less, but I think I’d take the old stuff back and deal with that – I’ve been doing it for years anyway. I usually get some ziplocs and weigh out the liquids into them. Then you can roll up the ziploc and cut the tip off of it and squeeze the liquids out to mix them. Fairly efficient, actually, I just don’t like the extra time to weigh it all out and I’m set in my ways when I find something I like. When they change it that really pisses me off. :D

          I’m gonna write up a new post here shortly to show how to weigh and mix the new stuff. I still like the spectralock, just don’t like (probably just not used to) the way it works yet. I’m spoiled. :D

          • Tyrel

            The ziplock idea is awsome, I was gona weigh it out but wasn’t sure yet how I was gona go about it. At the begining of your last post you said pro, did u mean the premium and get used to it?? I have both a hard epoxy float and a float with a rubber pad but its more flexable, the pad is the same material as the other float but has some flexable material under it. Thanks for all the tips. You think first wash 10 to 15 after application then and wait how long for final?? Do you use a scrub pad on the second like they say to do? I was talkin to a laticrete rep and he said he wipes the tile with a microfiber towel aswell, I don’t know if that’s with 1st or 2nd wash, good or bad idea? Last question right now too, ha, what do you use to clean with, their cleaning packet but what if u need to mix more water? Do you mix viniger and water?

            • Roger

              Oops, yup, I meant the premium. I prefer the hard rubber epoxy floats, not the ones with the spongy stuff under the rubber. That may just be a personal preference, don’t know that it makes much of a difference in the install – just what you’re comfortable with.

              I do my first was after 10-15 minutes and the second about 30-45 minutes after that. If I need to use the scrubby I use it on the first (and maybe a touch up spot here and there that I missed on the second) but only on the tile face, not near the grout lines. And I do use microfiber towels for my second wash – best thing you’ll ever buy for it!

              If you need more water mix cascade dishwashing detergent (the powdered stuff) with water. Not a whole lot, about what’s in the packages they give you, maybe a bit more. Don’t use the vinegar! It may be fine for most ceramic and porcelain but I don’t know what it does to the grout. Vinegar is an acid and IT WILL etch marbles and soft stones like travertine.

  • Steve

    I have not used Epoxy grout before, and want to give it a try. I bought the Spectralock and in the instructions it says –

    “LATICRETE® SpectraLOCK® Grout is a sanded grout. Use of sanded grouts in joints <1/8" (3 mm) will result in a coarser surface compared to surfaces in wider joints."

    My gaps are 1/32 and the stone is polished Marble. Will this still work good? Or should I use LATICRETE 1600 Unsanded Powder Grout?

    • Roger

      Hey Steve,

      Either one will work just fine. Make sure to check the epoxy on an extra piece or in a non-noticeable area to ensure it won’t scratch the tile. But it will work, I’ve done it plenty.

  • Jeff Hays

    Hi Roger,
    One of my buds is getting ready to grout his shower.
    He is pondering caulking all areas that will require caulk, changes of plane and such, letting it cure, then grouting.
    Is this a bad idea? Should grouting be done first, scrape out the areas to be caulked, let grout cure the do the caulking last?
    He was asking me about this and I could only give him a blank stare.
    Never thought about doing it this way.
    So I told him Id ask The Floor Elf.

    • Roger

      Hey Jeff,

      It can be done either way. That was actually the initial way it is taught to most apprentices. It guarantees that there is no grout in the gap. Doesn’t matter which way it’s done.

  • Dean

    I am currently using the Spectralock Pro Premium Epoxy Grout and have found the results to be great but the application very difficult. I have done a lot of grouting in the past and have never experienced the difficultly getting the material into the areas like am am with this product. The first 15-20 minutes the material goes on very well (with about 10% of part C with held b/c of narrow grout lines), but then the mixture quickly changes into a very thick paste that wants to roll out of the grout lines. I have to smash and re-smash it in. Like I said the end result looks great …. but any tips for better application? The product also doesn’t have the same coverage once it shrinks so I am using a lot more of the product than planned. I am indoors with temp at about 67, about 32 outside …. would the heater coming on make the material cure fatser.

    • Roger

      Hey Dean,

      Yeah, the new stuff is more difficult to work with – I’m having the same issues with it. I have been mixing up smaller batches of it to limit the problems. That’s about the only thing you can do with it.

      The heater will only make it cure more quickly around the heater vent, other than that it’s not going to affect it much.

  • Sherry

    I’m planning on installing a honey onyx backsplash in my kitchen. I’ve read that you have to be very careful what is used when it is installed so that the color doesn’t change. What products do you recommend so that installation and grouting preserve the coloring of the onyx. I assume that the tiles will need to be sealed also. Do you seal it before it is placed on the wall or before you grout it. Should the tback of tile also get sealed that is on a web sheet (using 1×2 brick mosaic tiles on a 12×12 sheet). Your advice would be greatly appreciated.

    • Roger

      Hi Sherry,

      No need to seal the onyx until after it’s installed and grouted, and you do not want to seal the back. You WILL lose some of the luminescence of the stone after it’s installed and grouted. Just sitting on your counter it is receiving light through the face of the stone as well as around all the sides. Once it’s grouted it will mute the light going through the sides. There is absolutely no way at all to install onyx tile without changing the look of it.

      The best you can do is use the brightest white grout you can find to maximize the amount of light through the sides. You also want to use a white thinset to set it.

      • Sherry

        Roger,
        Thanks for your reply.
        You mentioned that the luminescence of the stone changes with grouting but what about the color. Some comments I’ve read indicates that it changes the color to gray. Will it still look honey colored but somewhat duller?

        I have madira gold granite countertops and almond colored cabinets. Will white grout look funny?
        You mentioned to use thinset. But doesn’t that have sand in it. Shouldn’t an unsanded grout be used because the onyx is a polished stone??

        • Roger

          The color of the stone will not change. After grouting, and possibly for up to seven days afterward, you may experience what is called ‘picture framing’ which creates a darker border around the edges of individual tiles which may look gray, but it isn’t – the color of the stone has not changed. This is caused by water soaking into the sides of the tile as you grout and clean it up. It will eventually dissipate. Due to loss of luminescence from what I’ve described many people think their onyx is more gray or darker – it’s simply less light refracting through the stone.

          I mentioned to use thinset to set the tile – not to grout it. You need white thinset to bond the tile to the substrate. Unsanded grout is normally what is used for onyx.

  • Jane

    Hey Roger:
     
    Went to Lowe’s today to pick up the TEC grout, but they only have premixed. Bags are special order, so I ordered a couple, and four tubes of caulk in Mocha. It’s sanded caulk, to go with the sanded grout. Is this recommended? The bags of 25# grout run $8.34 each, the caulk is $14.10 a tube, with a minimum order of 4, so that’s what I ordered. I went back to make sure he ordered me the right kind of grout, because that price is something I’ve never seen before. My receipt says it’s correct, and he said it was direct from the manufacturer. Can this stuff really be this cheap?

    • Roger

      The regular tec grout is normally in line with the other brands. Are you sure they ordered the 25# bag? Because that sounds more like the price of a 10# box. The caulk sounds right.

      • Jane

        It sure does sound like that, which is why when I saw the price, I went back to the department after checking out and asked the guy if he was sure he ordered the 25# bag. It says 25# on my receipt, and he assured me that he ordered directly from the company. I said OK, but asked him why it states on their website that a 25# bag is $13.97. He said to me again, I ordered directly from the manufacturer. Time will tell, David seems to think they f**ked up somehow, and I will only know when my order comes in. Funny, World of Tile’s Sanded caulk is $10 a tube. I cannot be running all over town to get the best price on EVERYTHING. Got the C-Cure floor grout, and am happy about that. What I will do is go back to Lowe’s Monday and make them call the company again to make sure that my order is correct. What else can I do, Call TEC directly? I don’t have any contact info for them. If I get a 25# bag for $8, I guess I scored and it was their mistake. I’ll know on the 13th. I can always go to WOT and pay $25.99 for a bag of grout. OUCH!

  • Joe Jeezy

    I am using Mapei – “Slate sanded grout” for my ceramic tile floor. I used 1/16″ spacers. Anything i need to know?

    I used the Laticrete epoxy grout (sea glass) for my shower walls – which btw made it look almost white instead of the greenish look it should have been and also I used lowes TEC dolorean grey for the bottom section of my walls (with a 1/8th joint and sanded) and also I used SPECTRA-LOK  – MINT (Sanded – 1/8th joint) for the top section of my walls.

    4 different types/brands of grout in 1 bathroom. And im a first time grouter. I think the epoxy was the best choice BESIDES the color it turned out to be.  It was easy to work with, easy to clean up. BUT it does leave a invisible glaze on the tiles. The only way I noticed is when I was cleaning the tiles that are not being used with the epoxy grout. When you wet the tiles that are with the epoxy, they dont appear wet, They appear always dry compared to the tiles next to them that look wet. Thats the only way i can see this “film/glaze” But luckily when i go to install my shower doors, it will seperate this and it will not be noticablle.

    Good Luck everyone  

    • Roger

      Hi Joe,

      You can use a mild sulfamic acid solution to get rid of the epoxy grout haze.

  • Jane

    Roger:
     
    Lowe’s sells TEC grout. But it’s $14 a bag. Is this the same stuff you use?

    • Roger

      TEC grout (the regular accucolor) is nice and consistent and TEC’s accucolorXT has been a perfect match every time I’ve used it. Be sure to follow the instructions exactly.

  • Tad

    Hi Roger,
     
    Great site!  And trust me, I’ve seem a thousand of them while researching how to DIY tile my kitchen counter.
     
    I have two questions:
    1) I am using 23 inch  tiles which are 1/2 inch deep. Is 1/8 gap wide enough to get our epoxy grout deep enough into the 1/8 inch gaps between our tiles?
    2) The house is over a century so the wall is not a flat plane and waves quite a bit.  it is subway tile but where the counter meets it, the gap between our tiles and the wavy wall varies from one quarter inch to 3/8 inch.  Would it be best to grout this with our epoxy grout or caulk it with a backer rod placed in there?  and if the caulk is the way to go, what type would be preferable? (I guess I snuck three questions in there!)
     
    Thanks so much for any advice you can provide.
     
     

    • Roger

      Hi Tad,

      1. I use epoxy on 1/16″ all the time – so yes, 1/8″ is plenty.

      2. Ideally (I know, I know…) remove the subway tile, install 1/2″ backerboard or drywall shimmed out to a flat plane, and install a brand new backsplash for your new countertop. But (I know…) given what you have the best option would be backer rod and 100% silicone. I prefer Latasil by laticrete – you can get it in colors to match your grout. And yes, it’s gonna look like you caulked something that should not have been caulked. But it will look better than grouting something that shouldn’t be grouted, may crack, or worse – crack your tile.

      • Tad

        OK, sounds great, Roger!  I’ll tear out that subway tile tonight!  (or maybe not – he he!)  Thanks for the tip on the caulk – that I will most certainly do.  Should I use the caulk like a grout and keep it level to the counter tile or should it be a bit of a bigger bead that overlaps onto the surface of the horizontal tile of the counter? 
        (I do have some idea how I’m going to approach it because i’ve seen some tidy step by step pictures using blue tape to make a nice bead in the change of plane corner but the professional who provided the mini picture tutorial had created a perfect little space between the vertical and the horizontal planes which made it look much easier than i know it is going to be for a rookie like me).
        Thanks again, Roger – you’ve already been a great help.

        • Roger

          Overlap the tile a little bit. If you keep it even you’ll be able to see the edge of the tile – and how uneven it is. If it overlaps you can hide some of that unevenness.